Episode Transcript
Jesus said in Matthew 28:19, Go, therefore and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost. Welcome to Go Teach all nations, bringing you Christ's teachings through Australian and international speakers.
And here is today's presenter, Jason Thomas.
So let's pray. Heavenly Father, God, I'm so grateful that you have allowed us to be here at this time. I'm so thankful for the love that this church has shown, the amazing food that has been provided for us, this amazing church and God.
At this time, I ask that you forgive all of us of our sins and that you'll be pleased to dwell with us. Please to teach us, please to show us amazing things from your Bible. God help us by the end of it all to have a clearer understanding of this subject.
But more importantly, have a deeper love and appreciation for your plan of salvation. In Jesus name I pray. Amen.
First question. Is it important to understand the state of the dead? Okay, good. You're doing very well.
You have 100 for your exam. Yes, it's extremely important. I'm going to start by sharing a quote with you from Auntie Ellen.
It says, through two great errors, the immortality of the soul and Sunday sacredness. Satan will bring the people under his what deceptions. While the former lays the foundation of what Spiritualism.
The latter creates a bond of sympathy with Rome. So do you see how this subject could be very, very important? Because these two subjects are the tools of the enemy to deceive a lot of people. The immortality of the soul and Sunday sacredness.
The Protestants of the United States will be foremost in stretching their hands across the gulf to grasp the hand of spiritualism. They will reach over the abyss to clasp hands with the Roman power. And under the influence of this threefold union, this country will follow in the steps of Rome and trampling on the rights of conscience.
Yeah, see that. Is that serious? Is it important for us to know the state of the dead? Yes, it is. If you go to our channel, has everyone subscribed yet? Can I see the hands of those who have subscribed? And can we point to those who have not yet subscribed and said why you haven't yet subscribed? Please speak to us afterwards if you have questions on how to press the subscribe button and we will help you subscribe.
Everyone should be subscribed to the Advent Defense League. When you go to our channel, we have a playlist and the whole section is called the State of the Day. And by no means is this.
Everything that we have spoken of on this subject, the state of the dead. But it comes up a lot. You'll see the first one on the top of the list when critics read the Rich man and Lazarus.
Are there souls under the altar? Did EGW speak to her dead husband? To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. Question mark. Did Jesus preach to spirits in hell when he died? Has anybody ever heard that before? You've heard that? Some people believe that when Jesus died, he went to hell and preached to people.
And they teach that as doctrine. It goes on. Does the spirit ascend to heaven at death? Does it? There is also another major critic named Sam Shamoon who we have responded to.
And you see, even did Michael the Archangel resurrect Moses? There's a lot. This subject comes up a lot. So let's have a basic study on the state of the dead.
What do you say? Amen. We'll leave here equipped by God's grace. What is the state of the dead? I'll break it down in five little parts.
And by no means is this everything that could be said on the subject. But I think if you have these important parts, you'll be pretty strong. First thing we want to go over is this.
How was man created? Anybody know how man was created? Dust. I heard dust. Breath of life.
He became a living soul. Yes. Then the Lord God formed the man of the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and man became a living soul.
Amen. That's what a man is. If somebody asks you what is a living soul, you could just say, go to Genesis 2:7.
It was the breath plus the body coming together, Right? We think of these lights and electricity, Right? The way we have lights is that you have to have a light bulb, but you also have to have an electrical source going into that light, Right? And then you can have light. What happens if you remove the light bulb? Do you have light? What happens if you remove the electricity? Do you have light? You must have both combined together. Likewise, a body plus a breath.
That is a living soul. Amen. Are we good with that definition? Are you sure? All right.
Remember, they said they're sure. They said they're sure, Edwin. We're going to find out how sure they are.
What happens when a man dies? And by man, mankind, of course. What happens when a person dies? They take the last breath. They go back to the dust.
That's it. The spirit returns to God. Very simply, death is a reversal of life.
Death is a Reversal of life, right? This is what the Bible says. Genesis 3:19. In the sweat of thy face shall thou eat thy bread till thou return unto the ground, for out of it was thou taken, for thus dust thou art.
And help me say it. Unto dust shall thou return. That's what happens at death, friends.
It's a reversal of what God did. Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was, and the Spirit shall return unto God who gave it. Now that's a new word.
The Spirit returns to God who gave it. Somebody said breath. Let's see what spirit goes back to God.
For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also. Now notice Job 27, verse 3. Put this in your memory, friends.
This verse should always be at the tip of your mind and tongue and heart. When somebody asks, what is the Spirit? You should start with this one. What is the Spirit that goes back to God? Job said this all the while, my breath is in me.
And the Spirit of God is where now? In the beginning, what did God breathe into man? The breath of life. What is it calling it here? The spirit of God is in the nostrils. So that is what goes back to God at death.
Amen. That breath that he gave you goes right back to him. Okay, moving right along before we get to the fun stuff.
Remember, Edwin, they said they're sure they know what a soul is. That's what they said. What does a person know at death? Nothing.
Here's a few verses you could keep in mind. Put not your trust in princes, nor in the Son of man, in whom there is no help. Help.
His breath goeth forth. He returneth to his earth in that very day. What happens? His thoughts perish.
A lot of religions in the world are deceived on this subject, friends. There's a lot of spiritualism happening in the world. Most funerals that you go to that are not Seventh Day Adventists will say, oh, Aunt Lucy is in heaven right now.
She's watching down over us. But is that what the Bible teaches? It's what tradition teaches, but not the Bible. God has a better plan.
Amen. His thoughts perish. Famous verse, Ecclesiastes 9, 5 and 6.
You should know these by heart. For the living know that they shall die, but the dead know not anything. Neither have they any more reward, for the memory of them is forgotten.
Also their love, their hatred, their envy is now perished. Neither have they any more apportion forever in anything that is done under the sun. There are a lot of criticisms even on this.
If you have questions. Please ask them. Write them down.
We will try to answer all your questions. But I want you to know something else about this passage. It says the dead know nothing.
But it's also important to know that. That their non physical attributes are also deceits. Because love is non physical.
Their hatred, you can't tell where that's, that's non physical. Their envy is perish. So it's everything about the person is perished.
Okay. They are resting in the grave. Two more points, then we'll have fun.
What is a soul? They said they know what a soul is. What is a soul? Body plus breath. Okay.
Okay. All right, then. The Lord God formed the man out of the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and man became a living soul.
But this is going to challenge us a little later. So I'm going to give you the answers now. The word soul is the Hebrew word nefesh, which also means, can you see it? Life.
Keep that in mind. Nefesh. A soul, a living being, life, self, person, desire, passion, appetite, even emotion.
We should understand that even though the first primary definition of it is the whole person, you should know that it can also mean other things. The Bible uses it in different ways. Okay, just keep that in mind.
The Word. This word can also be translated as feelings or disposition. For example, in this word, in this.
In this verse, then saith he unto them, my soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death. Tarry here and watch with me. Does he mean my body and my breath is exceeding sorrowful? Or does he mean his feelings, his emotions? Right.
So just know that word can have different definitions based on the context. Amen. Keep that in mind.
Let's keep going. And the last point, we're going to talk about number five. Are souls immortal? Remember we read earlier, the issue in the last days will be two topics.
Who remembers what they were? Immortality of the soul and Sunday sacredness. So we need to get it right. Our souls immortal? No, because the Bible says about God, who only hath immortality, who only has immortality, Only God dwelling in light which no man can approach, unto whom no man have seen nor can see, to whom be honor and power everlasting.
Amen. Okay, how about this verse? Behold, all souls are mine. Who do souls belong to? God as the soul of the Father.
So also the soul of the Son is mine. The soul that sinneth, what happens to it? That means it's not immortal who is making the rules for this? Right. Because he says at the beginning, all souls are mine.
So he's the one that sets the rules for the souls. Amen. All right, we have just gone through our Bible study.
That was a nice recap. How you feeling? Warmed up like you did your exercise? That was your stretches. Good to go.
Now we're going to talk about common arguments against SDAs regarding this particular subject. Of course, these are common arguments. Some of them we've gone over already.
We didn't touch Michael, but we did touch the investigative judgment. We did touch the Sabbath. Day of atonement.
We touch. But today we're going over the state of the dead. And so here is the first problem.
First Kings 17:21. How do you answer this? Objection. Elijah asks for the soul to return to the boy.
Do you remember this in the Bible? Let's read it first. Kings, chapter 17. I'll read from 19 to 22.
There's a problem in this text because if your mind thinks that the word soul only means body plus breath, someone who comes to you and says this, you're going to question, was I taught the wrong thing? Well, let's see what it says. It says, and he said unto her, give me thy son. And he took him out of her bosom and carried him up into a loft where he had abode and laid him upon his own bed.
This is Elijah, by the way. And he cried unto the Lord and said, o Lord, my God, hast thou also brought evil upon the widow with whom I sojourn by slaying her son? And he stretched himself upon the child three times and cried unto the Lord and said, o Lord my God, I pray thee let this child's soul come into him again. And the Lord heard the voice of Elijah, and the soul of the child came into him again, and he revived.
Time out. You told me a soul is a body plus a breath, did you not? Did they not tell me that? So are you Seventh Day Adventist saying Elijah asked God for his body and breath to come into him again? Does that make sense? No. It's a soul that's going into the child.
I have written in the margin of my Bible here that Nefesh. And I'm no Hebrew scholar. All right? I'm just the pastor.
I'm no Hebrew scholar. Nefesh, translated here as soul, is also translated as life 117 times. Can we say amen for our good pastor? Amen.
So which verse would you use to talk about this? Yes, it is true. Soul can mean body plus breath. But the Hebrew word soul can also mean life.
It could also mean creature. The context is what tells you the definition. And here is a concordance.
If we look a little closer than that word neesh, as pastor said, it can mean soul 416 times, but it can also mean life. He said 117 times. Sometimes it could be lives or something related to that.
But yes, Pastor, it does mean life. And so now let's read the verse again. It says, and in verse 21, and he stretched himself upon the child three times and cried unto the Lord and said, oh, lord, my God, I pray thee, let this child's life come into him again.
And the Lord heard the voice of Elijah and the life of the child came into him again and he revived. Amen. Is that a satisfactory answer? Soul can mean life.
So, friends, even though we know body plus breath equals soul, we should also be more advanced and know that it can also mean life based on the context. Amen. We need to have this.
There are some other Bible translations that do say the word life. Actually, let's. Let's look at some of those translations.
Right? Let's actually go there. I wonder what the new King James Version says. You know, I mean, that's an okay version.
So KJV says, so new King James Version, what does it say? It says, oh, it also says, so let this child's soul come back into him again. What does NASB say? Let this boy's. Oh, life.
So some translations do say life, and we should be aware of this. It's good to read the Bible in different translations when you're doing your study. Let this child's.
What. So do you see that? All right. Amen.
Can we all say amen? You passed a test of. Dr. Jason, you are a student.
Thank you. Thank you. It goes downhill from here.
Now I become a meaner. Professor, this is. That was.
That was Bible Study 101. We're going to 102 now. It's getting harder.
How will you answer this? The Bible says the soul can mourn at death. Let's look at it. You see, here's the thing.
When you go to amazing facts, it's amazing Bible study, friends. Anybody familiar with amazing facts? We should know amazing facts extremely well. There's something you have to be careful of, though, and I'm going to show you in job, chapter 14.
You see, when we teach the dead know nothing, that's a very good thing. And we'll go to different Bible verses that tells us that the dead know nothing. For example, verse 21.
Notice what it says in verse 21. His sons come to honor, and he knoweth it not. And they are brought low.
But he perceive. If it not of them, why does he not perceive it? Because he's dead. And the dead know nothing.
Correct. And so you will see this verse and say, aha. The dead know nothing, and that's why his sons come to honor.
And he perceives it not, because the dead know nothing. But what does verse 22 say? But his flesh upon him shall have pain, and his soul within him shall mourn. Huh.
How does a soul within a dead person mourn? How do you answer this? This is a little bit more advanced. Okay. But his flesh upon him shall have pain, and his soul within him shall mourn.
Now, I want you to know how to refute this claim. The key word in this verse, there is a key word. Mourn.
That's the key word. Why is this the key word? You'll see it says mourn, and then it says H56. This is where you're going to need to start using the concordance.
This is a little more advanced, but we can do it. We can get something called the concordance. And we can see how the concordance defines these words when we look in the concordance.
This is a brown Driver Briggs concordance. We'll see all of these definitions for this word. More.
In Hebrew, it's abal. Am I close? Edwin? Okay. And it says to mourn, right? That's the word that's used.
But it can also mean to lament. And then Q, A, L. What's qal? Kal.
So one of the Hebrew forms, it can say to mourn, lament. Then it says 1A1 of humans. But notice what it says here of inanimate objects.
What's that next word? Did you see that? So the concordance understands the Bible uses this word when talking about inanimate objects. It means it's being used figuratively. Is a dead soul an inanimate object? A very.
Somebody said very, very inanimate object. Then it gives examples of gates, of lands. And so we can look at some of these.
If you go to Isaiah, chapter 3, verse 26, it says, gates, lament and mourn. Now, can a gate really lament and mourn? No. So that has to be used figuratively.
Can the wall lament? Can a wall lament? So that has to be used figuratively. Can land mourn? So that has to be used. So conclusion, there is a pattern of inanimate things.
Mourning. Therefore, the language is. Can we say amen for Nick? Good job, Nick.
But now you have to know why. And of course, we don't I don't have time to really show all these verses, but you could take a picture, or you can have this whole PowerPoint. It's yours.
If you ask, you shall receive. Amen. Does that make sense, friends? Do you see how, like this.
You have to get a little deeper in your study for this. But these are real issues that are out there. And if you're not used to this, it happens so many times, particularly amongst college students.
What? Your church did not teach you this? Did you know the Bible says this? How do you explain that with your church's beliefs? But we have to have answers for this. Amen. And be well equipped for these so that they don't catch us by surprise.
Moving along. There are souls under the altar. Has anybody ever heard this before? No.
Yes. Some have, some have not. There's souls under an altar in heaven.
Which verses would you use to refute this? Let me read it to you. Okay, let's go there. All right.
So that comes to us from Revelation, chapter 6. How do we refute this? It says in verse 9, and when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God and for the testimony. So it says, souls that were slain.
Does that mean they're dead or alive? Okay. They were slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held. And they cried out with a loud voice.
Huh? They cried out with a loud voice. Dead souls crying out with a loud voice, saying, how long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou now judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? And white robes were given unto every one of them. And it was said unto them that they should rest yet a little season until their fellow laborers also, and their brethren that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.
How do we explain this? We said, a soul is a body plus a breath. It can also mean life. But now we're seeing souls crying and talking and told to rest in heaven under an altar.
It's figurative. Can you prove to me that it's figurative? Is there more proof you can give me that we know this is definitely figurative? Number one, how do we know the book of Revelation speaks in symbols? Verse 1 of Revelation says this. The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him to show unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass.
And he sent and did something. What? What did he do? What does that word signify mean? Signs, symbols? Okay. It tells you from the very first verse.
This is a book of signs. And Symbols. This is the same words.
When Jesus says, if I be lifted up, I will draw all men unto me. Thus he said, signifying what? Death. He should die.
Symbols. Does that make sense? Was Jesus saying, hey, just lifting up in the air and everybody's going to come? Or was he speaking of something else? What was he speaking of? The cross. Correct.
That's the book of Revelation. That's how we know there's a lot of signs and symbols. Amen.
Going even to Revelation, chapter six, the context. And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals. Does a lamb typically open seals? So this has to be symbols of something else.
Right. Who's the lamb? Jesus. Right.
And then he sees, behold, a white horse. And he that sat on him had a bow. Okay, that sounds realistic.
And a crown was given unto him. And he went forth conquering to conquer. That sounds realistic.
He opened the second cell and there went out another horse that was red. Are horses typically red? I don't know. Power was given him that set on them to take peace from the earth.
That should kill one another. That sounds a little symbolic there. I heard.
Then there was a third one. There was a black horse. Somebody had a pair of balances on his hands.
Like, you start to see that this is starting to get even more symbolic. And verse eight. And behold, a pale horse.
Unusual. And his name that sought on him was Death, and hell followed him. Is that realistic, friends? Symbolic.
Okay, so we know we already scratch off the list. This has to be talking about symbolic language. So what does it represent? Yes, we can see that this was a very similar situation to what happened with Cain and Abel.
Right? Y' all remember the story of Cain and Abel? So what happened in the story of Cain and Abel? Verse 7, actually verse 8. And Cain talked with Abel, his brother. And it came to pass when they were in the field that Cain rose up against Abel, his brother, and slew him.
And the Lord said unto Cain, where is Abel your brother? And he said, I know not. Am I my brother's keeper? God said, what has thou done? That sounds like an investigation. God investigated.
Right here, friends. The voice of thy brother's blood cryeth unto me from the ground. Time out.
The voice of thy brother's blood cries. Does blood cry? No. Very similar to what you said.
Right? And now thou art cursed from the earth. That sounds like a judgment. Was there an investigative judgment right here, Edwin? That's another subject for a previous day or another day.
So we can see that this is a pattern of God to speak about blood in symbolic ways. We can match this also with Hebrews chapter 12, verse 24. Check this out.
Hebrews, chapter 12, verse 24. Notice what it says. And to Jesus, the mediator of the new covenant.
And to the blood of sprinkling that speaketh. That what? That speaketh Blood speaks better things than that of. So Abel's blood truly speaks symbolically.
Amen. But my sister says something very interesting. Did you know that there was blood poured at the bottom of the altar? Did y' all know that? Where can we find that? Leviticus, maybe chapter four, I don't know.
Verse seven. Notice what it says here. This is a sanctuary, friends.
It says this. And the priest shall put some of the blood upon the horns of the altar of sweet incense before the Lord, which is in the tabernacle of the congregation, and shall pour all the blood of the bullock. Where? At the bottom of the altar.
Do y' all see that? So what actually went at the bottom of the altar? Is there a connection between blood and souls? My sister said the life of the flesh is in the blood. That's what my sister said. Right? Let's look at that verse.
For the life of the flesh in the blood. So that means if the blood is at the bottom of the altar, what does that represent? The life at the bottom of the altar? And what's another word for life? Nefesh. So what is actually at the bottom of the altar? The word life? H5315.
Let's look it up. What word do we see here in the Strong's concordance? What's that word? Nefesh. And what did we already talk about with that word? Nefesh? 416 times? It means soul.
So what's at the bottom of the altar in the sanctuary, friends? The souls are at the bottom of the altar. But what is that soul pointing to? The life at the bottom of the altar. And what is that life pointing to? The blood that's at the bottom of the altar.
So therefore, when you see souls under the altar, if you understand the sanctuary, you understand that means slain lives. The blood that was spilled. Does that make sense? So that's what it's talking about, friends.
It's talking symbolically about those who were slain. Does that make sense? God sees that as lives. They're not literal souls that are alive in heaven.
Okay, let's go a little bit deeper in that. So are there souls under heaven? We should also know these verses very well. And this is actually my favorite part.
And this will actually answer a lot of questions against this subject. If you Memorize these verses. John 13.
Let's read John 13 and John 14. You know, some of these verses we say in church, and we really don't see the significance of it. But these verses are so significant, friends, and they really help us in our studies.
Notice John 13 and the context of this conversation. Verse 1 says, now, before the feast of Passover, when Jesus knew that his hour was come, that he should depart out of this world, unto whom, right, we know, Jesus died, and he rose and he went, ascended to the Father, right He. So this is the context of him before he goes to the Father.
Notice the conversation as it continues. Y' all remember that you know, Peter denied Jesus three times, right? Y' all remember what happened before that conversation? Let's read it. Verse 33.
This is Jesus talking, because the letters are red. Little children, yet a little while I am with you, you shall seek me. As I said unto the Jews, whither I go.
What did he say? So this is a verse that ends all arguments on going to heaven immediately at death. Because Jesus is saying, I'm going to the Father. Where I'm going, you cannot come.
So now I say to you. And he gives a new commandment which we talked about yesterday, right? A new commandment. But notice what Simon Peter said in verse 36.
Simon Peter said unto him, lord, whither goest thou like? Where are you going? Jesus answered him, whither I go. Thou canst not follow me now, but you shall follow me afterwards. So Jesus is setting the rules, you can't come with me to heaven now.
You're going to come afterwards. And that's when Peter says to him, lord, why can I not follow thee now? I will lay down my life for thy sake. Jesus answered him, wilt thou lay down your life for my sake? Verily, verily, I say unto thee, the cock shall not crow till you has denied me thrice.
I remember this, but the conversation continues. Let's go to the next chapter. Let not your heart be troubled.
You believe in God, believe also in me, in my Father's house. Say it with me, friends are many mansions. If it were not so, I would have told you.
Now say with me, I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you unto myself. That where I am, there you may be also.
Can you see how this verse ends? Any thoughts of somebody going to heaven at death? Because Jesus is telling his disciples, I'm going to prepare a place for you. You can't come with me now, but you will come with me afterwards. Does that make sense? We must have these verses on us.
This is a very powerful chapter. Let me show you one more. A must have verse for the state of the dead.
Acts, chapter 2, verse 29. You ever heard of David? Was David a man after God's own heart? Would David deserve to go to heaven? Well, this is what the Bible says about David. Verse 29.
Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulcher is with us unto this day. So what is the verse saying about David? He is dead and buried. Buried.
But what does it say in verse 34? Read this part with me. For David is not ascended into heaven. Is David in heaven? So, friends, we need to know this.
We need to know this very well. People don't go to heaven immediately. At death, Jesus has a better plan for us.
He wants us to go together. And that's why we, as Christians, we look for the resurrection. Amen.
Amen. We look for that resurrection. So these are very important verses.
Jesus told us that he was going to prepare a place for us, and we only go to heaven when he comes back. Revelation 6, verses 11. It doesn't make sense for people who are in heaven to be told to rest.
Did we even consider that part? God said to them, rest a little while. Does that make sense? You're in heaven and you're under an altar. How cramped up could that altar be? How big is this altar for all these souls to be under? Right? And that's another reason why we know it's symbolic.
Are we sleeping under an altar? But we know that sleep means that they're dead. Genesis 4, verse 10. We talked about this.
The martyrs are personified similarly to how Abel was. I did not read to you Hebrews 11:4, but let me read to you that real quick. And then we're probably going to go and have more fun.
It's going to get gooder. Did I make up a new word? Let's make up a new word together. Everyone say gooder.
It's going to get gooder. Let's read Hebrews chapter 11, verse 4 says this. By faith, Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, and by which he obtained witness that he was righteous God, testifying of his gifts.
And. And by it he being dead, yet speaketh. Is that not powerful? Concerning Abel, the Bible is saying that he speaks even though he's dead.
How is he speaking even though he's dead? Symbolically, by his blood. Okay. All right, let's move right along.
Still have about a good 20 minutes. And we already talked about the life of the fleshes and the blood. We know that's the souls under the altar because the blood was under the altar in the sanctuary.
Last one on this subject. And then we're going to talk about hell. What about this verse? You hear it at many funerals? I don't know if you have, but I've heard it so many times.
You know Aunt Susie, she's absent from the body and present with the Lord because the Bible says to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. How do you answer that? Let's talk about it. To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.
Which verses do we use to refute that? The first verse we should use to refute that is the verse itself. Friends, I'm going to disappoint you. The Bible actually never said, to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.
It never said it. That verse does not exist. It's just something we hear.
But where do we get it from? Tradition. The verse never said that. What does the verse actually say? Look at what it actually says.
We are confident, I say, and notice these two words. Willing rather. We're willing rather than to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord.
Is that different than to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord versus we are willing rather to be absent from this body and present with the Lord. Would anybody want to be absent from this current body and present with the Lord? We should all want to be present with the Lord. Does God give us a new body? Yes.
Do you want your new body? So we should all be willing rather to be absent from this body and present with the Lord. But the verse never said, to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. Do you see that? No matter what version you check of this verse, of whatever Bible you check, it never said it.
But we just think it says it for some reason. Now, what is the context? Why is he saying, we are willing rather to be absent from this body and present with the Lord? Well, let's see. Let's actually go back one chapter and we're going to have a Bible study.
It says in verse 16, for which cause we faint not, but though our outward man perish. Ah. Isn't that a condition of our current life? Though our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day.
Ah. I'm seeing here a pattern for our light affliction, which is but for a moment. Oh, yes.
Does anybody here have affliction worketh for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory. Are we seeing a pattern here? Our current condition versus what we're looking forward to. While we look not at the things which are seen, that's our current condition, but at the things which are not seen for the.
Oh, that's the future condition. So do you see? There is a theme that he's going to be showing us. For the things which are seen are temporal.
Is that our current condition, but the things which are not seen are eternal. Ha. So he's bringing up two different ideas.
Our current condition versus a condition we should be willing rather to. To receive. But let's keep going chapter five.
For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, okay, that's when we die, right? We have a building of God and house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. That's speaking about God giving us a new body, is it not? I'm not going to color everything, but you can do this on your own. For in this we groan, right? Do you groan in your body? I went to the gym today.
I groaned a little bit. I did. Does anybody groan in their body? Earnestly desiring.
That sounds like willing, rather. Right? Earnestly desiring to be clothed with our house which is from heaven. Are you willing rather to be clothed with that house from heaven? Amen.
If so that being clothed, we shall not be found naked. For we that are in this tabernacle groan being burdened. Do you feel burdened in your tabernacle? Maybe.
Maybe you don't. Because the weather is really nice here in Australia, but back in New York, Mercy. I groan a lot there.
Not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon. Now notice these words that mortality might be swallowed up of life. Question.
When is mortality swallowed up at life? At what? At the. Say it proudly. At the resurrection.
At the second coming. At the resurrection. Remember, friends, the name of this book is called Second Corinthians.
That means there's a First Corinthians, right? Did he speak about this in the First Corinthians? Did he say, at the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump, this mortal will put on immortality? So he's talking to the same audience. He's reminding them, yes, we have immortality to look for at the resurrection, at the second coming. Does that make sense? So that's what he's talking about now.
He. That have wrought us for the self. Same thing as God, who also have given us the earnest of his spirit.
Therefore, we are always confident knowing that while we're at home in the body, meaning while we're here on earth, we are absent from the Lord. Yes, physically speaking, we are not with the Lord. He is physically in heaven.
But then he says, for we walk by faith, not by sight. So by faith we know we're always with God, but physically, we're not there. And then he says, we are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from this body and present with the Lord.
Does that make sense? So he never said, to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. He says, we're willing rather to be absent from this body and present with the Lord. When does that happen? At the second Coming.
Does that make sense? I'll read a few more verses. Nine says wherefore, meaning everything I said, based on everything I said. Here's the main point.
We labor that whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that everyone may receive the things done in his body according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. The point is, we're looking for a new body.
But still, while we're in this body, please God. Amen. Because we're going to all stand before the judgment seat, we're willing rather to be in that new body, but to get there, we have to please God.
Amen. All right, so that answers that question. And these are all the verses that we can use.
So if you read the context. Let me rewind a little bit. It says this.
Nope. No, I'm going the wrong way. All right, so to be absent from the body, it says this.
The context is about our current bodies feeling pain and us desiring our glorified bodies from God. Paul was speaking of the body we get when mortality is swallowed up of life. If you go back to 1 Corinthians, chapter 15 and first, Thessalonians 4, 16, that body comes at the second coming.
Amen. When we read the verse commonly read, to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord, but it actually says, we are willing rather to be absent from the body and present with the Lord. Amen.
All right. How you doing? Y' all hanging in there? We're almost done, friends. We're almost at the finish line.
We're almost there. Two more questions. All right, maybe three.
Or maybe more. I mean, if you want more, I could give you More. But Jesus preached the spirits in prison when he died.
Has anyone heard this before? You've heard this? No one else has heard this? Oh, you've heard this? This is. You've heard this? This is a real doctrine out there, friends. They believe that when Jesus died, he went to hell and he preached the spirits in prison.
I want me to read you the verse. I'll read you the verse. I'll read you the verse it says in First Peter, chapter three.
Now, friends, if you remembered how I just answered the previous question, you should pick up a pattern on how to answer this question. Let's see if you could pick it up. Let's see if you could pick it up.
Let's read first Peter, chapter 3, verse 18, 19 and 20. Verse 18 says, For Christ also have once suffered for sins the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the spirit. So you see, friends, Jesus was put to death in the flesh.
Do y' all see that? In the verse by which also he went and preached unto spirits in prison? So you see, friends, when he was put to death in the flesh, he went to preach the spirits in prison, which were sometimes disobedient, when once the long suffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was preparing, wherein few, that was that his eight souls were saved by water. So you see, friends, when Jesus was put to death in the flesh, he went to preach the spirits in prison. So therefore he went to hell and preached the spirits in prison, and they resurrected with him at his resurrection.
So will you join my church or will you teach me what this verse is actually saying and why I'm wrong? Why am I wrong? Let's read the verse carefully. Okay? The part where people trick you is when they read the verse the wrong way. Notice how I read the verse.
For Christ also suffered once for sins the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God. And here's the part, the crucial part, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the spirit, by which he also. Do you see the problem if I highlight being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the spirit.
Bing. The main point is actually that part that they say too fast. The verse doesn't say, when he died, he preached the spirits in prison.
It doesn't say that. What it does is, yes, he was put to death in the flesh. What's that next word right there? But what.
So now, by this part of the verse, is he dead? Or alive. So now you ask the critic. It says, he's quickened by the spirit.
Is he going to hell alive? No, that doesn't make sense. So that already ends what they think, because the verse ends with him being quickened by the spirit. That's point number one.
Point number two, who is the one that is quickening him, according to this verse? The Spirit. Okay, so he's quickened. Now it says, by the Spirit.
Okay, let's highlight that. Now, what are the next two words? Who is this referring to in this part? The Holy Spirit. Now the focus is on what my sister.
Yvonne. Yvonne, right. Said the spirit is the focus.
Okay, so what the verse is saying is, yes, Jesus did die, but he was quickened by the Holy Spirit. By which meaning? By that same Holy Spirit that raised Jesus from the dead. What happens next? He went and preached the spirits in prison.
Okay, so it was the Holy Spirit preaching. The same Holy Spirit that raised Jesus from the dead is the same Holy Spirit that is preaching. The next question we want to ask is, when was this preaching done, which sometime were disobedient, when once the long suffering of God waited? When? In the days of Noah.
So now the verse is saying, oh, that same Holy Spirit that raised Jesus from the dead is the same Holy Spirit that was speaking in the days of Noah while. When? While the ark was preparing. Does that.
You see that? What was the result of this preaching? It says it right there. Wherein few, that is eight souls were saved. Who were the eight souls that were saved? Noah, his wife, his three children and their wives.
That's what the verse is saying. It never said that he went when he died. He preached the spirits in prison.
Because the verse doesn't even end with him being dead. It ends with him being alive. So the focus is not what he did when he died.
The focus is on what the Holy Spirit did who rose from the dead. That Holy Spirit was the one preaching in Noah's day. Can we confirm this? Did the Holy Spirit preach in Noah's day? Yes.
Notice what it says in Genesis, chapter six, verse three. And the Lord said, what's those next words? My spirit shall not always strive with man. Y' all see that? That's what this is talking about.
The same spirit that was striving with man is the same spirit that rose Jesus from the dead. Does that make sense? We could talk even more about this. The word spirit.
We didn't talk much about the word spirit. The word spirit we said means breath, but it can also mean the whole person. Okay, so he was Preaching to people in Noah's day.
How do we know that the word spirit can mean the whole person? We can see verses like, First John, chapter four. Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits, whether they are of God, because many false prophets are going out into the world. Hereby know you the spirit of God.
Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is coming to flesh is of God. So we can see here is we're not talking to ghosts and we're not talking to breaths. I would never want to talk to her breath.
That'd be weird, right? You talk to people, right? Okay, so that's what it's talking about, friends. And yes, you are right. You are in.
We can be prisoners to sin, right? Jesus says this, you know, if any man commits sin, he is a slave to sin or a prisoner to sin. And I come to. If I make you free, you shall be free indeed.
Let me go to it, because I'm. I don't remember what Jesus says. This is what Jesus says.
Then said Jesus to the Jews which believe on him, if you continue my word, then you're my disciples indeed. And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. Please don't say, set you free, say, make you free.
Do you know the difference between set and make? There is a difference, by the way, if you set something free, like, here's a book. This is the condition of the book. I'm putting it here.
You're now set free. Okay? You're exactly how you were. I just put you in a new location.
But if I make something free, that means I'm doing something special to it. I'm making it, I'm creating it new. Jesus wants to make us new.
Amen. He doesn't want to leave us the same when we come to him. So there is a difference between set and make, in a sense.
But if you want to say set free, you can say set free. But I do prefer make free. Do you want to be made free? Amen.
They answered him, we be Abraham's seed and were never in bondage to any man. Do you see that word, bondage? That's prison right there. How sayest thou? You shall be made free.
Jesus answered them, verily, verily, I say unto you, whosoever commits sin is a servant of sin. Okay? That's the idea of being a prisoner to sin. And that answers that question.
All right, let's pause here. If you have more questions, you could come to me afterwards. But let's have a word of prayer, okay? Heavenly Father, God I thank you for this time where we could discuss this subject.
Lord, I pray that what was shared will spark our interest to study deeper, to not just accept what we've heard, but that we can go really deep and say, hey, do I do what I believe? Does it really make sense? Am I truly in line with what your Word says? God, I ask that you will reveal certain things that we may miss as we study our Bible. But most importantly, Lord, let us love you even more to want to go deeper into knowing you. I thank you for what you have shared with us tonight.
Let it do something for us that will produce fruits and souls coming your way. I ask this in Jesus name, Amen. This message was made available by the Waitara Seventh Day Adventist Church.
For more resources like this, visit waitarachurch.org au.
SPEAKER B
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